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Debate on Mother tongue, Punjabi

Manzur, Nadir, Usman, Davendar, Shahid

March 10th, 2010

3.5 / 5 (5 Votes)

 

 

From: Manzur Ejaz <manzurejaz@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Asiapeace (ACHA) Fw: more re Fw: Mother tongue
To: "omar ali" <omarali502000@yahoo.com>
Date: Tuesday, March 9, 2010, 2:25 PM

A standardized language is measured by its written classical literature and Punjabi has one. The question of dialects of Punjabi is usually brought up by those who are wedded to Urdu and who have never read a single text of Punjabi.

Some of them bring up the excuse of Punjabi script. For Punjabi writers, from Baba Farid to the present, there is no such issue: Punjabi script in which most Punjabi classics were written is much less complicated than English and French. Just pronounce go and do, talk and walk and you know the complication.

Earlier another critic had brought Punjabi issue in India blaming the language for division of Indian Punjab into three provinces. This knowledgeable critic has used this argument without any context. In fact Punjab was divided on Sikh demand because they wanted a Sikh dominated province. Many agree if Indian Punjab was not divided Punjabi could never become the official language of Punjab . So, what is wrong in dividing areas if it suits the needs of the citizens? What kind of an Urdu/Hindi dominated area could be called Punjab ?

Same critic brought up the same an excuse of overlap between Urdu and Punjabi. There is an overlap between most North Indian languages. Sindhi and Punjabi are much closer than Urdu and Punjabi. Learn some Sindhi and you will know it. Urdu/Punjabi overlap is touted too much because Punjabi children are taught in Urdu.

I feel people who want to keep Urdu as a medium of education for political purposes make excuses which have no basis.

 

ME 


--- On Tue, 3/9/10, omar ali wrote:


From: omar ali
Subject: Asiapeace (ACHA) Fw: more re Fw: Mother tongue
To: "asiapeace" <asiapeace@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Tuesday, March 9, 2010, 2:01 PM

 



--- On Tue, 3/9/10, Nadir Ali <nadirali1936@gmail.com> wrote:


From: Nadir Ali
Subject: Re: Asiapeace (ACHA) Fw: Mother tongue
To: "omar ali"
Date: Tuesday, March 9, 2010, 11:09 AM

It is a familiar argument if you write Punjabi and read the miniscule Punjabi journals or listen to voices from the  the anti Punjabi ambush sites . The opening of the mind if you converse write and read , using your mother tongue and  the the efficacy of early education in child,s mother tongue, are beyond doubt .The existence  of dialects is universal . Ever heard of the cockney spoken in London . The three major writers of Persian wrote in different dialects i.e., Firdausi , Saadi and Rumi . Their writings and Persian cultural renaissance made the great Persian language . The roots lie in people,s language as opposed to the state and upper classes language . In most languages spoken in the north of the South Asian sub -continent are similar to each other especially if you look at the verbs .Neither Urdu nor Sanskrit are among these . Even in old Bengal they argued about Upbrahm Bhasha , Sanskritised ,  and language of the the common people spoken the eastern part of Bengal in the the Nineteenth century Great Bengali writers made it the great language it is today . Dr Manzur Ijaz , whose services to Punjabi are legend ,knows what he is talking about . There is a UN resolution about the right of a child to study in his mother tongue and a land mark decision of the US Supreme Court recognises this right , if a school district has majority speaking a language other than English   .

 

On Tue, 3/9/10, Lahore Chitrkar <info@lahorechitrkar.com> wrote:


From: Lahore Chitrkar
Subject: Re: Asiapeace (ACHA) Fw: Re: Fw: Mother tongue
To: "omar ali" <omarali502000@yahoo.com>
Date: Tuesday, March 9, 2010, 1:56 PM

Dear Usman, the difference between urdu and punjabi is not of dialect, saraiki, hindko, mahji, pothohari are dialects, urdu on the other hand is a communication tool which evolved as a convienence for people with diverse languages brought together for buisness interests, urdu as a false lingo also remains a tool to opress true languages and rob us of our poetry, folk tales, music in short our real physical experience. it causes cultural alienation and helps produce parrahay likhay unparrh, mirza

Lahore Chitrkar
Studio & Gallery
http://www.lahorechitrkar.com/index.php

----- Original Message -----

From: Manzur Ejaz <manzurejaz@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Asiapeace (ACHA) Fw: Re: Fw: Mother tongue
To: "omar ali" <omarali502000@yahoo.com>
Date: Tuesday, March 9, 2010, 3:16 PM

How has someone computed that the difference between German and Swis-German schools is the same? Has the respondent expertise in all four sets?

How far is Urdu from Punjabi..Very far. This is my opinion because I write and publish in both languages on a permanent basis.

If someone reads some classical literature the touting of Punjabi dialects should end.

Then despite the difference between two versions of Chinese (I am not an expert in Chinese) it is still Chinese. So is it being said that Urdu is Punjabi or vice versa.

Why someone is so pained whenever the question of mother tongue is raised?

 

Manzur

 

 

 



--- On Tue, 3/9/10, qusman1 <usman.qazi@gmail.com> wrote:


From: qusman1 <usman.qazi@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Fw: Mother tongue
To: "omar ali" <omarali502000@yahoo.com>
Date: Tuesday, March 9, 2010, 12:23 AM

The question is whether Urdu is so far from the mother-tongue of children speaking certain dialects of Punjabi so as to be ineffective?

My answer is: Not at all!

Swiss-German children learn standard German at school. The linguistic distance between their own dialect and standard German is comparable to Punjabi and Urdu.

Mass literacy actually works to the detriment of dialects and regional languages. A prime example of that is France.

Then we have Chinese with huge distances between Mandarin and Cantonese. Guess which language is the official one?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vernacular_Chinese


--- In asiapeace@yahoogroups.com, omar ali wrote:
>
>
>
> --- On Mon, 3/8/10, davender bhardwaj wrote:
>
> From: davender bhardwaj
> Subject: Mother tongue
> To: "omar ali"
> Date: Monday, March 8, 2010, 4:49 PM
>
>  
>  
> Omar,
>  
> I was travelling and could not reply to one refuatation of article in Wichaar which said that teaching in mother tongue is superior to teaching in an alien language.
>  
> Someone said that it was not true especially as Punjabi has many dialects. The Amrtisari/Lahori Punjabi is different than the Seraiki. I think that is not an argumanet against the mother tongue. All langaugaes that are spoken over large areas tend to have dialects and accents which are very different. Even in case of English, it is very hard to understand the Irish English form the Main land English. So is the case with other languages including Chinese, Arabic, Hindi etc.
>  
> Davender
>

 

 

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Visitors Comments

Name:Nayyar Hashmey
Date:19th March

Comment: I think the script of Punjabi language is indeed an issue. The script which we now use for Punjabi, the Persian nastaleeq doesn’t do justice with the actual phonetics of Punjabi words. This is one major reason of Punjabi having lagged behind Urdu as it is now only a spoken form hence termed by many as a dialect.
Quoting example of do and go is OK for English but it cannot exactly be compared to the position of Punjabi.
Until and unless there is a script that suits the phonics of Punjabi, Punjabi will remain a dialect and our kids will go on speaking and writing Urdu as we do too.

I love my mother tongue i.e. Punjabi but when I have a desire to read Punjabi texts, merely because of the script, I just escape and come back to reading Urdu.

In the Eastern Punjab/India the Sikhs already got the solution by adopting the Devnagri script for Gurmukhi but we don’t have any script except this borrowed one from Persian. This borrowed mode renders us keep reading and writing Urdu for we do not have a script that makes Punjabi worth reading and writing.

Nayyar Hashmey
http://wondersofpakistan.wordpress.com/


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